why do people get banned at shaving sites?

Well celestino and CHSeifert, I, for one, am thrilled to have both of you, AND you unique perspectives, here to contribute to the conversation.

Artisans and vendors  who need to pay to get positive reviews won't last long. It's something that I've never done and don't condone. I HAVE sent out free samples when I was starting out to find out how folks liked what I was making. Lucky for me at least one gent liked it and "talked" it up. But he has paid retail the same as everyone else ever since. Everyone who posts reviews of my products pays full retail and no one gets favored status. Their products come from the same shelf that I fill orders from and where I get my products for my own use.

I do request testers periodically, and they do get free samples to test. I couldn't very well ask them to pay for the "privilege" of testing my products for me. Later they may write a review of the tested product, but I don't (and won't) control that. I just don't believe in it. I want my products to stand on their own merits. No amount of false reviews will convince folks that a junk product is actually good. I sometimes send out free product to some folks and I request that they give me an honest appraisal of it; no strings attached on my part. Like it or hate it, I want the truth. I like to think that keeps me on my toes and I get to help out folks who never expected anything. I always request that they say nothing about it. After I die if they want to 'fess up they can. Yeah, I'd like to be able to do it for everyone, but that just isn't possible.

I still feel bad about charging for samples that I would send out for free when I was getting started. I make nothing on them and I try to give a meaningful sample, but I still feel bad about charging folks for them. It's a terrible deal IMO since the labor cost is so high, the same as a full size bottle, but I try to make the quantity worth while. I consider my customers to be my friends and I want them to get a decent shake. I try to go out of my way to insure it. Same as this site does.

Heck, I try to put myself in the customers shoes as much as possible. I also try not to act at all like the sites that I've been on who thought that the members were just there to be fleeced. One in particular is always crying poverty and begging for money. I can't even remember the last time that I was there. But I'm just rambling now. I need some sleep (in a minute).

I'm active on 4 shave sites today. One that I support, this one. One that's all volunteer and the hosting is free so they don't take money, it also fills a very small niche in the shaving world. Another that is similar to this site, but I try not to abuse the product discussion there, and TSN; 'nuff said. My webmaster tells me that it would be better for business for me to put more time and effort into the other sites, but I like it here, screw business. Not everything is dollars and cents. This is home. A dip of my hat to management.

Now I need some sleep.

You have just confirmed every good thought I have ever had about you. Class act, all the way around.

Thanks B&M. Dang, I need to get some sleep.

Business is easy IMO. There's one secret or maybe a few, all related. Don't screw over folks and treat them as I'd want to be treated. It's just common sense really. The rest either falls into place or it doesn't. Doing it right makes business easy. I know nothing about business other than that.

I worked for a place that did everything exactly the opposite of what I wrote above and they have nothing but problems. The more their practices made their business suffer the more they put the screws to the employees and the more the employees screwed over the business. I took it as an object lesson in what not to be, but what was "right" was in me all those years in working for that place. I'm no longer there. When I saw the exit sign I took it.

I bet if you asked management here they have the same basic philosophy. I never did ask, but it shows. People pick up on it.

:-) Really, I need sleep now. :-)

Well celestino and CHSeifert, I, for one, am thrilled to have both of you, AND you unique perspectives, here to contribute to the conversation.

Thanks Will,

Always interesting to find new forums with fresh and new perspectives on things.

And good to find you here. Your scents are - by far - the most unique in the shaving soap world.

Most of us know, that Celestino has 150+ shaving soaps in his collection, 99% are from Mystic Waters, but even he must agree to the fact, that Mchelle might make the most pleasant scents, but you make the most daring, unique and advanced/polarizing scents in shaving soaps today

Cheers, Claus

The internet ego of some of the, "old guard," surprised me at other places.  Yet I'm 45 years old and have been doing this much longer than some of the, "old guard."

Go figure.  I chalk it up to there are some real fing dooooooshbags on the internet with way too much time on their hands.  Reddit comes to mind, but hey, I don't want to name any forums.  Ooooooops lol.

I was quite surprised to see how fast it went from a warning to a ban.

My believe/guess was that you stepped on a mods toes and got the ban, because you Perhaps argued in pm's with said mod.
But if not so, the ban seemed quite harsh IMHO

I've never been banned though. From here or any other shaving forums. I've seen i happen from time to time though

I was banned from the Shavenook for "trolling" (literally, a permanent ban with a single word explanation). Anyone who knows me and my posts should realize how ridiculous that charge is.

As for the actual reason, I suspect it was two things: First, I made a negative observation about a paying vendor that is favored by the mods (one of their mods called this observation "trolling", and literally explained that my analytical way of reviewing was a problem), and gave a positive review to Barrister & Mann's Night Music; second, I made a call for free discussion without bias from the mods/admins, observing that their moderation team selectively moderates certain posts positively and shuts down others quickly, depending on whether or not the vendor pays them. I had quite a few private messages from members asking what one of their admins had against me personally in order to treat me as he did.

Very suspicious site. I find it hilarious that the mods/admins maintain this authority by simply stating that they don't give reasons for why members are banned. Convenient, ain't it?

And honestly, vendors should take this into account when they advertise on sites like TSN. Consider this: If you give money knowingly to a site that is practically one big advertisement masquerading as a forum (a forum that bans people indiscriminately), you're indirectly contributing to their shady practices. When members see admins/moderators bullying members for holding contrary opinions, or shutting down threads and banning members on trumped up charges, they are smart enough to realize that the site is compromised and its posts have no credibility. People aren't stupid.

I was quite surprised to see how fast it went from a warning to a ban.

My believe/guess was that you stepped on a mods toes and got the ban, because you Perhaps argued in pm's with said mod.
But if not so, the ban seemed quite harsh IMHO

The internet ego of some of the, "old guard," surprised me at other places.  Yet I'm 45 years old and have been doing this much longer than some of the, "old guard."

Go figure.  I chalk it up to there are some real fing dooooooshbags on the internet with way too much time on their hands.  Reddit comes to mind, but hey, I don't want to name any forums.  Ooooooops lol.

I was quite surprised to see how fast it went from a warning to a ban.

My believe/guess was that you stepped on a mods toes and got the ban, because you Perhaps argued in pm's with said mod.
But if not so, the ban seemed quite harsh IMHO

I've never been banned though.  From here or any other shaving forums.  I've seen i happen from time to time though

Sorry, it was a misquote.

I was quite surprised to see how fast it went from a warning to a ban.

My believe/guess was that you stepped on a mods toes and got the ban, because you Perhaps argued in pm's with said mod.
But if not so, the ban seemed quite harsh IMHO

CHSeifert, I didn't get a warning, nor did I receive a single PM from any moderator or administrator. What could they have warned me against doing anyway? I was nothing but polite to every single person on that site. Remember: They banned me for "trolling".

That's the problem with TSN's policy on not talking about why members were banned... They can ban people without cause without the remainder of the membership being able to dispute it. And without knowledge of what goes on via PM, everyone assumes that it was for good reason.

And by the way, that complete of moderator/admin contact on the other site (before the ban on laughably trumped up charges) stands in stark contrast with the treatment I received on this site. Soon after joining, I received a personal welcome PM from a mod and a great conversation.

On the other site, I was actually lectured by an admin for being excessively analytical (I kid you not).

Some users are breaking the rules and being a troll, or sometimes it's an ego trip.