Soap Operas

There is a difference between not caring what happened elsewhere or why, and not being informed as to what happens elsewhere and why.

In my experience, nobody is really ignorant to the rest of the online shaving world, most of us just don't care. "We"don't care because we choose to disassociate ourselves from such nonsense.

We dislike it occurring here not because it is false but because this place is different. The admins and owners are not secretive. The rules are not convoluted. The treatment is fair and equal.

Bringing the drama from a place that thrives on it to a place that avoids it is unnecessary, and here, at least, it is frowned upon and should be discouraged.

Inevitably those threads draw participants from both sides for no other reason than to continue that which was discontinued elsewhere.

We are not clueless here. Quite the contrary, the drama is frowned upon because the results are all too well known as is the cause...


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+100

I was a lurker here for a long time. I decided to join after a long period of observation. In the end I was attracted to 3 things

1.  The threads were more interesting to me than those at other forums
2.  The participation of vendors
3.  The absence of drama prevalent in other forums

The culture here is different--in a good way. Let's not change.

Just my opinion.


-Mark

thanks for considering us!

There is a difference between not caring what happened elsewhere or why, and not being informed as to what happens elsewhere and why.

In my experience, nobody is really ignorant to the rest of the online shaving world, most of us just don't care. "We"don't care because we choose to disassociate ourselves from such nonsense.

We dislike it occurring here not because it is false but because this place is different. The admins and owners are not secretive. The rules are not convoluted. The treatment is fair and equal.

Bringing the drama from a place that thrives on it to a place that avoids it is unnecessary, and here, at least, it is frowned upon and should be discouraged.

Inevitably those threads draw participants from both sides for no other reason than to continue that which was discontinued elsewhere.

We are not clueless here. Quite the contrary, the drama is frowned upon because the results are all too well known as is the cause...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

+100

I was a lurker here for a long time. I decided to join after a long period of observation. In the end I was attracted to 3 things

1.  The threads were more interesting to me than those at other forums
2.  The participation of vendors
3.  The absence of drama prevalent in other forums

The culture here is different--in a good way. Let's not change.

Just my opinion.


-Mark

thanks for considering us!

Thank you go for having me!

Many scholars assign the murder of Hypatia as end to the classical period in history. I doubt the fleeting affairs of a niche hobby will merit even such a footnote in arcania: It does give one pause driving a chariot without advance intelligence regarding recent arrivals from the desert.

Now go listen to Rick DeWise rant https://brushnsoapnblade.wordpress.com/2...-and-more/ start around 1:01. Its ALWAYS about money.

Man, he is good! Thanks for posting that link.

It might always be about the money, but what is really important is how people go about making that money. Profit is good, but only as long as its pursuit does not cross the boundary between ambition and greed. That boundary is imposed by society, and applies equally to brick and mortar and online entities. Crossing that line brings negative consequences in one way or another. So does running a forum in a poorly thought out or inept manner. Thus the conflicts.

I found it interesting that Mr. DeWise noted that Reddit and Facebook have become replacments for forums to a large extent. Such a transition would be one of the negative consequences, at least for poorly run forums. Damn Fine Shave, because of its unique approach and good management, definitely does not fall into this category. We should count ourselves lucky.

And eBay? People are bitching about ridiculously inflated prices on eBay? Seriously? That is like being surprised that trees are green and the sky is blue.

Man, he is good!  Thanks for posting that link.  

It might always be about the money, but what is really important is how people go about making that money.  Profit is good, but only as long as its pursuit does not cross the boundary between ambition and greed.  That boundary is imposed by society, and applies equally to brick and mortar and online entities.  Crossing that line brings negative consequences in one way or another.  So does running a forum in a poorly thought out or inept manner.  Thus the conflicts.

I found it interesting that Mr. DeWise noted that Reddit and Facebook have become replacments for forums to a large extent.  Such a transition would be one of the negative consequences, at least for poorly run forums.  Damn Fine Shave, because of its unique approach and good management, definitely does not fall into this category.  We should count ourselves lucky.

And eBay?  People are bitching about ridiculously inflated prices on eBay?  Seriously?  That is like being surprised that trees are green and the sky is blue.

Yes, he is very good. His points on how forums make money are spot on. And I think many people flood to reddit simply because there are, virtually, no rules. I know I rebelled against the word "gentleman" but I rebelled in the sense use say in 1890. This forum is a fair set of common sense rules that are, well, common sense. Reddit is more the "real internet" and can be NSFW.

But in the end, its always about money. The more a website keeps you at their website, the more they drive traffic to their vendors. This is true on personal blogs as well. Those little Amazon ads or generate revenue to the blog. Click bait.

Yes, he is very good. His points on how forums make money are spot on. And I think many people flood to reddit simply because there are, virtually, no rules. I know I rebelled against the word "gentleman" but I rebelled in the sense use say in 1890. This forum is a fair set of common sense rules that are, well, common sense. Reddit is more the "real internet" and can be NSFW.

But in the end, its always about money. The more a website keeps you at their website, the more they drive traffic to their vendors. This is true on personal blogs as well. Those little Amazon ads or generate revenue to the blog. Click bait.

I am not sure what on Reddit is NSFW. I have never pictures of naked chicks, drugs or weapons on Wicked Edge. The posting format is not as flexible as older style forums, but posts filled with jackassedness quickly disappear down the message chain. The system is self-regulating in that regard, even if a little wheat gets chucked out along with the chaff. Regardless, I do very much agree that Damn Fine Shave is common sense and well run. One thing that is somewhat of a problem is the complaining about other forums here.

Constant complaining about injustices on other forums can both distract and detract from the content here. Are we a uniquely well done shaving forum or simply a venue for criticizing the behavior on other websites? Not that the critiques are unwarranted or unneccesary. On the contrary, I think there is some very bad behavior going on in the wetshaving world that needs to be stopped post haste - Abusive behavior on some forums, censoring posts that are fully compliant with their rules, astroturfing by individuals seeking free product or by for-hire companies posting good reviews for pay, conflicts of interest, deceptive business practices, etc. The rest of the world needs to be given a heads-up, but in a way that does not detract from the rest of Damn Fine Shave. That is why I proposed a special sub-forum earlier for such content. Oh, well, I guess the folks running this place will know the best way to handle it. They certainly have done a great job so far.

Not to belabor the point, but I was unaware that the definition of "gentleman" had changed over the years. The 1828 Websters Dictionary definition includes:

GEN'TLEMAN, adjective [gentle, that is, genteel, and man. See Genteel.]

1. In its most extensive sense, in Great Britain, every man above the rank of yeomen, comprehending noblemen. In a more limited sense, a man, who without a title, bears a coat of arms, or whose ancestors have been freemen. In this sense, gentlemen hold a middle rank between the nobility and yeomanry.

2. In the United States, where titles and distinctions of rank do not exist, the term is applied to men of education and of good breeding, of every occupation. Indeed this is also the popular practice in Great Britain. Hence,

3. A man of good breeding, politeness, and civil manners, as distinguished from the vulgar and clownish.

A plowman on his legs is higher than a gentleman on his knees.

4. A term of complaisance. In the plural, the appellation by which men are addressed in popular assemblies, whatever may be their condition or character.

Numbers 2 and 3 seem especially applicable. In short, a man who acts like in a civil manner , regardless of his station or occupation, as opposed to a someone who acts like a ditch pig or a buffoon. I view Mr. Webster as a higher authority on the English language than the rabble at Warthog & Wallow. For that reason, I will claim that his usage guidlines are to be preferred over theirs. Of course, that is just my opinion.

A plowman on his legs is higher than a gentleman on his knees

That's not praise for gentleman. That's Ben Franklin slamming Gentleman saying a hard worker is better than a rich fat cat living on his inheritance.  

men of education and of good breeding,

What does "education have to do with" good manners? Its a means to slam those who not only don't have college degrees but those not from the "better schools" (think Ivy league).

What does "good breeding" mean? This should be obvious. We have no titles but it means "rich". Not the nouveau rich but old money - inherited money. As Ben Franklin said, its better to work hard that sit around idly as "Gentlemen". Young ladies sought men "of good breeding". This is inherited wealth.


http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.ph...20breeding

A vague old-fashioned term used by aristocrats and people who believe they are better than others. May mean being raised well: courteous, polite, part other things, etc. Few know what the term actually means because everyone who uses it defines it differently to criticize the lower-class. But apparently it is one of those things that you can only understand if you have it.


You can think it means anything else but the message is clear to those not "educated or of "good breeding""  You might think it means "being polite" but the logical fallacies here are lead bricks.

All gentleman are not polite
All polite people are not gentleman.

Rather, its  catchphrase the industry has hijacked to go along with an old fashioned idea that Wet Shaving is somehow noble rather than doing what the common man might do with an electric razor or cartridge. I see how some who "traditional wet shave" look down on those that merely "wet shave" and those that wet shave look down on "dry shaving: or used "canned goo". Just think about the words "canned goo", a phrase used extensively in this hobby to demean those that don't use traditional tools. Yet they are "gentleman?" Really? Do gentleman look down at the tools of others?

Its a phrase I found  just weird, in this day and time. It brings up a class structure. Just look how its used in posts. They start

"HI Gents ....

(text)

Thanks Gents"

Its a mean to create a bond in a virtual world. Complete with little clubs within that world. "Lets all go to the "sitting room", smoke cigars, while the ladies do whatever they do."

Yeah, Ben Franklin was right. I'd rather work the fields and plow them doing a hard day work than "be a gentlemen". He was a wise man. And I don't think its a good idea to create these virtual divisions. Its a given that everyone should be polite and have good manners.

Thanks for that quote.

It's 2016...The idea that the word "gentlemen" is only applied as a means of division is inherently false.

For example, I use the word frequently, not to look down on others, but as a means to respectfully address more than 1 individual man, as in; "Gentlemen: Does anyone know where I might find...."

The only insult in a phrase of this nature is in the readers' own interpretations. If grim were to take offense to it, thinking I am intentionally leaving him out because I do not believe him to be educated, polite, or worthy of the title, than it is only in his mind because factually speaking, there is no justification for me to consider him anything less than a gentleman that conducts himself respectfully and with honor.

It's not a way to insult and divide as much as it is a way to make a general addressing of the public in a polite and respectful manner. I use the word because anyone that chooses to respond and offer insight deserves respect.

Words evolve. Using a definition from the 1800's to justify or condemn modern vernacular is erroneous at best...

Assuming that every use of the word is inherently meant as an insult indirectly levied against someone not present is also erroneous at best...

I'd also like to add that the belief that an "educated person" must mean one with a college degree is also patently wrong. There are a lot of really dumb people with expensive, Ivy League degrees, and a lot of really intelligent individuals that have never seen the inside of a classroom in the realm of "Higher Education".

Again...it's 2016...We live in a world where every single piece of known information is readily available to any individual that wants to learn. And educated individual can be truly educated in the highest sense of the word without ever leaving the comfort of their own living room. All it takes is an internet connection and a desire to educate oneself...

To attribute characteristics to a word that have not been applicable since the middle of the 20th Century is failing to allow those words to evolve along with humanity...

It's 2016...The idea that the word "gentlemen" is only applied as a means of division is inherently false.

For example, I use the word frequently, not to look down on others, but as a means to respectfully address more than 1 individual man, as in; "Gentlemen: Does anyone know where I might find...." A term of complaisance. In the plural, the appellation by which men are addressed in popular assemblies,

This interpretation is the fourth definition above "A term of complaisance. In the plural, the appellation by which men are addressed in popular assemblies, ..."

And the last one in the definition, commonly used as in Ladies and Gentlemen.

Yes, its 2016 but look carefully and closely at hows its used and the insinuation as a means to demean those that "don't act as gentlemen" with gentlemen a very distinct social class. I'm not talking about the attribute of being polite but how its viewed in the very real world. Someone "not a gentleman" can be viewed as being vulgar and a clown. Yes, its being polite and having manners.

But in this industry its also used to form a virtual club of sort. To exclude those that don't belong. Just think about the unshaven, 3 day beard, or grubby look currently "in". Look at any movie or TV and one of the male stars sports the "grubby" look. This is actually hurting the industry. And the constant demeaning "canned goo". Do gentleman refer to the MOST popular shaving cream in the world in demeaning terms?

Its very real. Maybe its also regional. "Gentleman" go to Harvard and Yale. Common folks go to state colleges. I've seen it and those attitudes.