#21
I have never purchased a shaving product mentioned on a shaving forum that was not excellent. Some needed better techniques than I have or my first choice just went on sale.

Marketing samples are common everywhere. Product Reviewers should not be expected to be rich and able to buy all the products. Small artisans need an economical method to market their products.

I understand fake reviews are common. Some are real obvious, sounds like many are on Amazon. If the individual with the shaving post/review has gained my respect, i will read every word. If I see 10 consecutive posts with the same opinion, I start to believe. Reading posts/reviews from those with related knowledge and experience is normally a good thing.

Posts/Reviews I skip include: 1) obvious "greatest product ever" or "excessive admiration" 2) many Amazon and many novice reviews 3) something triggered person's "hot-button" and highly biased comments 4) unrelated or non-educating

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#22
I've made a few reviews, and if I gave high marks it's because they deserved it with any quirks noted even the best may exhibit. I just don't feel like even mentioning the artisan nag champa bought on EBAY that sent me screaming fully dressed into a cold shower. All this five star or 10 or thumbs up is a neurotic need to place a concise
value and measure on a natural world that recognises no inches. It comes down to buy it or pass.

Tbone likes this post
#23
(This post was last modified: 07-23-2017, 10:18 PM by User 852.)
I've bought some products in the past without reading any reviews, based on my instinct. I liked them a lot.

I never buy shaving stuff because a Youtuber "liked" them. These guys like everything they get. Guess why.

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#24
Never say never. A company can send IE a razor to a well known shaver with a pass around list to let lots of people kick the tyres. Harney and Sons Tea loved my crazy reviews until they had to refresh the website. They always include a few free sample teas with client's orders. I exchanged emails and Mike sent gratis his book on tea with 'issues' upon hearing my short book collection on the subject. I think it lost a bookjacket or something. Many companies SELL or give out samples. All those inane gameshows hardly buy trips to Paris or a new Fiat car but get them for ADVERTISING. When is the last time anyone saw the cute kids for C&H sugar or Mrs Olsen with her Mountain Grown Coffee? Wouldn't you REALLY rather have a Buick? You get market share and product recognition and you don't have to promote.
#25

Restitutor Orbis
I think it should matter. The reviewer should say if it was a gift or they paid for an item.

For those starting out, some reviews can be helpful however relying on them can be a problem. I have a ton of stuff here that I find mediocre and yet was highly praised. Not saying they were wrong but just saying it's really a YMMV thing, however there is a big however. Consensus is still very valuable.

After trial and errors, and jumping into hype wagons time and time again, I have learned that peer consensus is much a much more reliable gauge if I am likely to appreciate a product or not. A reviewer is just one person, he has his own experience, his own bias and sometimes his own ego.

It's difficult to pay big bucks for someones ego.

I think the more experiences we gather is almost always better than one. I tend to check out consensus, and after a while in this hobby, you'll develop that instinct that sometimes tells you a certain product is being overhyped or genuinely brings something new to the table.

I once told a friend that I am only shooting myself in the foot by not praising a high value item that didn't work for me. I'm the guy who spent money on it, and if I don't praise it as much I may not be able to resell it easily, but I am not in this hobby to resell. Others have surely enjoyed it, but I didn't. I don't see a reason why I shouldn't share my own personal findings in a forum for us enthusiast.

I understand we all have our experiences, and I have made a mental note on guys that I think are on point in their opinions. I gather all that, even newbie opinions and use that as my guide if I am going to spend again. This is not to think newbie opinions are lesser, but I know for certain many of the stuff I liked when I was starting out isn't that amazing in retrospect. I think experience is more reliable and I value that and earns an extra point when reading reviews.

Reviews are entertaining, and if done right is very informative and helpful, but like with many things in this hobby, your best reviewer and guide is still you. Have a good nose for hype, try a product, be true to yourself, and when you share your reviews in the forums, do it honestly, with integrity while still keeping tact and being polite to the artisan or craftsman. Don't be a jerk, but don't sugar-coat things too much that your message cannot be understood. Not all products are bad, and certainly not all can work for you.

There is no need to sugar-coat things, just do it with tact and respect, and expect that not everyone would feel the same way. If there is a consensus, then more likely that not, it's not you, but it's the product that may need some improvement.

An artisan once offered me a sample with my purchase. I appreciate samples, specially for us non-CONUS, almost everything is a blind buy gamble. I told the artisan I appreciate the sample only for the scent, to help me determine my next purchase but I don't do reviews well, and to be honest I am kind of lazy to do that really, this is a very personal hobby; but if I liked a product I am certain to recommend it to my friends. It's in our nature to talk about things we really liked.

The first time I tried the 6s, I kept talking about it cause I really liked it. Not sure about the makers as of late, but I enjoyed the 6s and I still recommend it. It's great value and performed very well for me.

A trick I learned with blades is that I read threads, and take mental notes on guys that mentioned and liked blades that worked for me as well. I then start to pay more attention to their other favorites, and more often than not, other blades they liked even obscure ones works well for my skin too.

Not always, but it seemed to have served me well. I have hundreds of tucks of excellent blades that I wouldn't even know about if it weren't for these peer reviews.  Happy2

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#26
(This post was last modified: 07-23-2017, 10:27 PM by Tbone.)
(07-23-2017, 02:56 PM)Hardtop01 Wrote: Ok folks I go back and forth on this one so hear my thoughts and then let's hear your thoughts.

About a month or two ago, a collaboration between a razor maker (which I respect and have two custom razors from) and a somewhat mainstream shaving vendor put out a product I was interested in.  The product was well presented and in line with what the razor makers typically produces.  I went to the shave forums and youtubers to actually see the product and to get their "collective" opinions on the razor since it was new.  I use the word "collective" very loosely because you need to take opinions with lots and lots of salt.
I think that you have a very reasonable, rational and logical approach.  Do your homework, use your head and analyze what you find, and use common sense.  It is hard to fault that methodology.

Quote:That's where things kinda went off the rails for me since review after review everyone had gotten the item for free.  At the time, I actually could not find a review where someone had in fact invested their own money in the product, tried it, and gave it the thumbs down or up.
For me, fake reviews are a big red flag.  Even if the reviewers are not intentionally dishonest, their reviews will almost certainly be biased.  It would be a "Don't bite the hand that feeds you" sort of a thing.  If a product really is good, then why would the manufacturer need to resort to freebies in return for shilling?  Far worse are those ethically challenged souls who sell their soul to the devil in order to get free product.

Quote:Yes there is the "buyer buy in" element, but wetshavers are a pretty good group that we generally come clean when we make questionable purchases, and collectively laugh at them.
Some do, but a select few won't.  Regardless, the buyer buy-in is still a form of bias and needs to be taken into account.

Quote:Providing the disclaimer that they didn't purchase the item doesn't make the situation any better and when giving the item away after the review(if that's what they choose to do) do they go back and purchase?
Sometimes they will go back and purchase one of the item.  This is done to give credibility to their review, but they seldom state that they paid full price for the purchased item.  On Amazon, the additional item is purchased to add the "Verified purchaser" tag is added to the review.  Even if purchased at full price, the freebie represents a 50% discount between the two items.

Quote:Anywho, my wife thinks I was being a bit of a putz for holding that against them, and I really couldn't articulate why this aggressive marketing was any worse in wetshaving.
It is not any worse in wetshaving than other places, but that's because it is pretty bad everywhere.  Deceit is not OK, regardless of the products being shilled.  IMHO, you are being entirely reasonable for calling out biased reviews for what they are.

Are fake online reviews killing consumer confidence?
Marketing Land

The Truth About Fake Online Reviews
The Atlantic

How to spot fake product reviews online
Kim Komando

How to Spot a Fake Online Product Review
Lifewire

How to Spot Fake Online Product Reviews
RealSimple

The huge number of articles on this subject shows the pervasiveness of the problem.

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#27
(07-23-2017, 08:42 PM)Marko Wrote: I will look at reviews as just one source of information and wouldn't usually base a buying decision purely on a review.  I've tried enough products by now to have an idea of who makes stuff I'm likely to like and guide myself that way.  That doesn't help me with new artisans but I have no interest in buying any more pricey hardware and I don't have a problem springing for a tub of soap or aftershave on spec.  

This is exactly how I feel about it, but there may be a few more pricey hardware purchases in the future if something interesting comes along.

Marko likes this post
#28
There was a poster on SMF and TSN went by MERKURMAN, not sure if he's here or still active. He remains the sole shaver who posted he LIKED Merkur blades and I doubt anyone is shipping him free 100 packs. I remember when Fisherman's Warf in San Francisco was an actual fishmongers and old man DiMaggio had a stand. You never smelled anything fishy there. Now I get sou'western and bearded logoed boxes of fishstrips flash frozen off Indonesia after a dip in GM soybean crust mix unless I break out the flyrod gathering cobwebs..
#29
(07-23-2017, 10:42 PM)KAV Wrote: There was a poster on SMF and TSN went by MERKURMAN, not sure if he's here or still active. He remains the sole shaver who posted he LIKED Merkur blades and I doubt anyone is shipping him free 100 packs.
I have seen a few other guys on The Shave Den state that Merkur blades worked well for them. Those blades worked very badly for me, but it seems they do work for some folks.
#30

Restitutor Orbis
I haven't even tried those blades, too many bad reviews.

I might, one of these days. I think I may have a tuck here somewhere.

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