Our search for a new oven. Why doesn't the USA make quality appliances anymore?

Brian, thats very interesting, I have the older eyes thing too so I think I'll look into that micro red dot sight solution. I'm not doing anything competitive at the moment and I'm not sure I will. Its funny up here in Canada - if you listen to the hype you'd think that it is a heavily controlled jurisdiction but that isn't the case. If you're a law abiding citizen with no criminal record you can buy pretty much whatever you like. There's 3 legal purposes to own - hunting, target shooting and collecting - we're not allowed to defend ourselves. No full autos, no short barrels and there's magazine capacity restrictions -10 for a pistol and 3 for a LR. We don't have CC either. I trained with weapons back in the military in my early 20s and didn't carry it on into civilian life until about 10 or 12 years ago when there was a federal election and one of the parties running (liberals) said that if they were re-elected they'd ban handguns. I didn't need to be told twice, I went right out got my permits and got some. I figured its harder to take it away from me than it is to stop me from getting it in the first place. Fortunately that government wasn't re-elected (until now) and that issue went away. Its a fun hobby - something zen like in putting a hole in a piece of paper right where you want it from a long ways away.
Mark

I agree, it is zen like. I feel a story coming on. .. Many years ago, in a state 600 miles south I shot Bullseye matches. I wasn't a fantastic shooter back then and I'm still not, but I enjoy shooting. One day of a scheduled match saw 1/4" of black ice everywhere, but matches were never called off and since it was a town shooting team against other town teams there was more than just shooting involved, we had to show up and shoot or throw the match by default and maybe lose for the season. I got to the range and the conditions were horrible. It was difficult to stand, and getting into a proper shooting position was almost impossible. That day I shot the best I ever shot. I only dropped 2 points outside the bullseye for a 298 score. Near as I could figure the conditions had me relax and afterward I looked back on it and realized that the gun had been like an extension of my arm. I wish I could do that on demand. The stress of competition had been removed and I was able to do what I'm capable of doing.

Yesterday I shot my last Action Pistol match of the season and didn't do as well as I had hoped, but I had my buddy with me as a brand new shooter and my mind wasn't 100% on shooting. I did OK, but I know I could have done better if I had been more focused. To make it worse my buddy was disqualified for unsafe handling. Safety is #1, above all else, in an Action Pistol match and has to be with all of the running, firing, reloading, and such; it would be far too easy to put a bullet through flesh it wasn't so heavily stressed. So after having some of my performance sapped his score was also expunged. We both lost out. That one match was enough for him. He claims that it's too stressful (exactly the point) and he no longer wants to do it. If there wasn't any stress it would be like shooting paper in the back yard. The stress factor is exactly why I shoot competition. We can carry and I do carry, and if someday I should need to use I don't want to spray and pray and hurt innocent bystanders. Troops who have served in the sand box have shot with us they claim Action Pistol is as close to the real thing as one can get without incoming rounds.

If you ever do get involved in competitive shooting, even just for kicks and not seriously, check into Action Pistol. I know of only one other way to have as much fun and that's done between consenting adults. If you google Action Pistol or do a search on YouTube bear in mind you'll see a lot of "race guns" and race gear. Most of us shoot production guns and what can be modified on one is almost nothing. They're mostly straight out of the box as they came from the factory.

Unsafe handling, ouch.  Did they pin ribbons of shame on him?    I'm not sure I'm into the kind of frenetic paced stress that you describe in Action Pistol.  I like the peace and quiet of waiting for/hoping to make the perfect long range shot.  Stress but a different kind.  Amazing where discussions about ovens and the shameful state of manufacturing of consumer goods leads isn't it?
Mark

That had run through my mind. :-) But the thread had run it's course and it was my thread to hijack.

Yeah. He was 1 of 2 DQs on our squad. In order to holster one must unload, show clear and demonstrate it by closing the action and dropping the hammer on an empty chamber. His gun went off demonstrating that he hadn't unloaded it. That's an instant disqualification. The other was a dropped loaded handgun. A huge no-no and another instant DQ. There are 2 types of Action Pistol shooters, those who have been DQ'ed and those who will be. The take away from it is to learn and move on.

Action pistol isn't for everyone; that's for sure*. But it is fun. After a match I feel as though I've been through Faluja for a day. It's draining. I wish I was in my 20s again. I think it was age and stamina that got my buddy. Not everyone takes it as seriously as one sees on YouTube. I don't work as hard at it as what's seen there, and most don't. If they are held near you go watch one. The reality isn't 100% YouTube.

*3 gun is more intense and for that reason I don't think I'll ever participate in it. I know my limits.

I think that would be interesting. I'm going to see if there is ever anything nearby. Firing a round while proving safe is really embarrassing. Thats probably the loudest shot you'll ever hear. I can recall an unplanned shot many years ago in basic training, we'd been in the field on exercise for almost a week and it was early morning in the coastal rain forest, mist not yet cleared, people were going about their morning ablutions and getting ready to form up on the road and get on with the day - it was very quiet until a shot rang out as loud as anything I'd ever heard or so it seemed, there in the middle of the harbour stood frozen a certain recruit holding his weapon with a look of shocked, oh shit surprise on his face, smoke drifting from the muzzle. Good thing on these exercises we carried blank ammo or somebody might have bought it. That recruit did buy it a few years later as a crew member of one of 2 C-130s that got a little too close on low level manoeuvres and clipped wings. both aircraft and crews were lost. On the lighter side of that story, on the same morning, as I was forming up on the road with my weapon slung on my shoulder, the Platoon Captain indicated to me that I was out of uniform - a boot lace was protruding. So I bent to fix the problem and the slung weapon came unslung and briefly hit the dirt - tmy oh shit moment. I earned our platoon 200 pushups for that. Mr. Popular.

If you go to the USPSA site you should be able to see if there's a club that holds them. The competition is international. I'd be very surprised if they're not in Canada and near you somewhere. Three gun is interesting also, but for me it's just too complex to get right. Canada might not allow the rifles required for 3 gun, or maybe there is an alternate type used for it.

Yeah that look is priceless. That's the look the gent who dropped his handgun had. I couldn't see my buddy's face.

Brian, thanks for the information , you've given me lots to look in to and think about.

Back on the subject of stoves, funny but it wasn't until reading your description of the self-destruction of your wall oven in the face of ordinary use that I realized that the oven was intentionally made that way to stand up to only the lightest of use in a showpiece kitchen. Otherwise the avalanche of consumer complaints would bankrupt the company. But that doesn't happen because only the few people who actually use their stoves would complain and they seem to be very few. I appreciate honest feedback from real people to get reliable information. You can't look at magazines like consumer reports who are just shills for the makers of the products they "review".
Thanks,
Mark

Because all of the quality manufacturers are in the Andes exploiting the Incas.

We complain about the way Congress does nothing because the Dems and Reps cannot agree on anything. However, my thesis is that it is worse when they DO agree. Case in point - the Dems and Reps TOGETHER made it easy for companies to leave the US. I remember the vote on NAFTA [ where President Clinton had a hard-on for allowing "free trade" with Mexico], wherein Clinton's proposal had more Republican votes than Democrats.

Moral of the story - I'd rather the Republicans and Democrats do NOT agree; at least there will be some jobs left for Americans.

I've said that for years Ted. No disagreement here.

But political discussions can get out of hand really fast so I'd prefer it to not go further.

Brian, I think its settled. All discussions about stoves or cooking devices in general will ultimately lead to politics.
Mark