#1

Member
Seattle, WA (USA)
(This post was last modified: 01-18-2023, 11:21 PM by draebeard.)
The Chinese (and Japanese) make very good copies.  They even make notable improvements on their copies, such as the Feather ASD2 over the Gillette Tech and the Lexus LS400 over the W123 series Mercedes Benz.  However despite their high intelligence, for some reason they seem to lack conceptual inventiveness.  Hence they always borrow and copy.  

I think that reason is the use of character language, where each word has it's own unique character.  Unlike with alphabetical languages, you cannot change a word by changing one letter, and you cannot play Scrabble with character languages.  The kind of conceptual agility implicit in the game of Scrabble does not develop in the mind of the character language user.  Hence the character language user has a hard time thinking outside of the box.  

So while the character language user will of necessity have a better memory and faster and more accurate recall, he or she will not have the conceptual agility that invention requires.  Which is why the Chinese make copies, and mostly very good copies.  The Chinese did after all invent gunpowder, but it wasn’t until the Germans got their hands on some, five centuries later, that the gun was invented.
#2

Just Here for the Shaves
Williamsburg, KY
(This post was last modified: 01-18-2023, 11:33 PM by Dave in KY.)
The Russians did the same. Look at all the Russians versions of vintage Gillette and Schick Razors on eBay
This post by Dave in KY mentions views and opinions expressed and makes it known that they are "those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of DFS or any other member, agency, organization, employer or company."  Big Grin
#3

Member
Seattle, WA (USA)
True, but most of those came from the Soviet era.  Since Russia threw off communism their creativity level has improved considerably.  Unfortunately in recent years the USA has been becoming the USSA.  The more we are taught (as children) to believe lies, the harder it is to discern truth (and think outside the box).

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#4
(This post was last modified: 01-19-2023, 01:45 AM by yohannrjm.)
(01-18-2023, 11:45 PM)draebeard Wrote: ....  Since Russia threw off communism their creativity level has improved considerably. ....

Hmm, what post-communism innovations are you thinking of? I honestly haven't noticed anything specific that they have gifted the world with recently.

From my understanding of the USSR/Russia, they made some pretty amazing advances, given the repressive government system they were under.

Just take space exploration:
1st satellite to orbit the earth - USSR
1st animal in space - USSR
1st man in space - USSR
1st long-term space station - USSR
(there are more - check Wikipedia. These are the ones I could think of off the top of my head)

1st people to reach the moon - USA (Yay, we won!)

I don't know enough to get into the relative benefits of writing systems on innovation, so I'll stay away from that topic.

However, the recent Chinese tendency to make copies of western items seems to be born of the global economy. The USA and Europe are the biggest spenders. People are going to make what will sell in these countries. Trying to get Americans to wear Indian national dress or use Chinese-style tools is not going to make you money. If the market wants DE razors, they'll make DE razors. If the market wants reliable cars, they'll make reliable cars. You give your principal buyers what they want, and they want cheaper items that are familiar.

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- Yohann
#5
This is a very interesting topic you have brought up. I had a good friend who was a commercial pilot and also an instructor on 747’s who would agree with your idea of thinking outside the box.
#6

Member
Seattle, WA (USA)
Two more excellent Chinese copies:  
Dscosmetics Z.0 V2 stainless steel copy of the Mühle R41 is mostly superior to the original at <1/2 the price.

[Image: xuvmuuY.jpg]

And the Yaqi Romulus, a copy of the Blackland Vector, is 10 grams lighter and more efficient at 1/3 the price.  And it's made from 316L stainless steel, compared to the 303 or 304 stainless that Blackland uses.

[Image: wkPDpMu.jpg]

Like I said before, the Chinese are not very good at original thinking, but they make exquisite copies.

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#7

Member
Chicago Suburbs
Do not sell the Chinese short on inventiveness. They created some of the most important inventions in history.

Paper to replace papyrus.
Moveable type for printing presses to replace carved plates
Gunpowder
The compass without which the Americas would never have been located by Europeans.
Alcohol brewing
The first mechanical clocks
Production of tea
Producing silk fabrics from silkworms
The umbrella without which the British would stay soaked.
Acupuncture as a medical practice
Smelting and forging iron.
Porcelain
The first seismograph t detect earthquakes
Rockets fueled with gunpowder
Bronze- China was the first country to enter the bronze age.
The Kite
The seed drill to plant rows of seeds. That is the forerunner of modern planters.
Farming in rows. Where would the corn farmers of the Midwest be without that invention.
The toothbrush made from horsehair and bamboo; now copied in plastic.
Paper money was first printed in China as an outgrowth of paper making and moveable type.

To give credit where credit is due, this list is not my own but copied from the website below. Those who believe the Chinese lack inventiveness should read this page along with the references.

https://china.usc.edu/sites/default/file...ntions.pdf

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#8
(This post was last modified: 11-29-2023, 05:58 PM by Karveme.)
And then the Chinese thanked the great white ghosts for many of those inventions and we packed up and moved to beverly,I mean europe.ohh the Rex envoy is very aggressive compared to the Karve C plate and D comb plate.
#9

Member
Seattle, WA (USA)
(11-29-2023, 04:41 PM)RayClem Wrote: Do not sell the Chinese short on inventiveness. They created some of the most important inventions in history.

Paper to replace papyrus.
Moveable type for printing presses to replace carved plates
Gunpowder
The compass without which the Americas would never have been located by Europeans.
Alcohol brewing
The first mechanical clocks
Production of tea
Producing silk fabrics from silkworms
The umbrella without which the British would stay soaked.
Acupuncture as a medical practice
Smelting and forging iron.
Porcelain
The first seismograph t detect earthquakes
Rockets fueled with gunpowder
Bronze- China was the first country to enter the bronze age.
The Kite
The seed drill to plant rows of seeds. That is the forerunner of modern planters.
Farming in rows. Where would the corn farmers of the Midwest be without that invention.
The toothbrush made from horsehair and bamboo; now copied in plastic.
Paper money was first printed in China as an outgrowth of paper making and moveable type.

To give credit where credit is due, this list is not my own but copied from the website below. Those who believe the Chinese lack inventiveness should read this page along with the references.

https://china.usc.edu/sites/default/file...ntions.pdf
Your point is well taken.  However I wasn't criticizing their inventiveness, but their lack of conceptual fluidity and their tendency to groupthink.  This is by no means an exclusively Chinese problem.  Very few people think for themselves.  Which is why democracies fail, always gravitating to the lowest common denominator.  

Lastly, the invention of paper money has enabled a small group of very cruel and greedy people to create money out of thin air and lend it at usury; enriching themselves whilst impoverishing the rest of us and setting us at war against each other.  If there's a hell, they belong there.
#10
(This post was last modified: 11-29-2023, 07:13 PM by Karveme.)
You can see the lack of inventiveness by their alphabet or lack there of,some alphabets make you put letters together to form sentences,kanji is memorized,think about that…edit: kanji is Japanese,hmmm more thinking is needed.


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