Blackland announces new Tradere Razors

What's the hold up on Tradere? Is it gonna be a while before you break your silence on a release date?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What's the hold up on Tradere? Is it gonna be a while before you break your silence on a release date?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I haven’t been silent about a release date; I just don’t have one yet. Machining is wrapping up now. Polishing is up next.

I guess I've never ran into or read your rant on pass arounds so I had no idea on your position on them and it is your release and you can do as you please with how it goes to market.  I do however have to say I partially disagree with the statement that it's not a new razor. As I feel it probably is to 90% of the wet shavers out there in the same manner as the Gibbs which is a razor I've been a fan of for about 3 years and now there are two duplicates of it, one that's already been released and the other on it's way. I'm sure even though there were thousands of Gibbs made way back when,  I’m pretty sure only a very small percentage of wet shavers to date have tried one. So how many people have used a Tradere? I"m guessing not many. I realize there are drawbacks to pass arounds. One being the person who gets the razor usually only has it for a short time and in many cases I've seen them use it once, draw a conclusion on whether they like it or not and pass it onto the next in line on the pass around list without giving it a chance. Even when guys keep them for 2 to 4 shaves there are razors out there that take longer than that to dial in so once again maybe the razor isn't properly judged. My statement was it seems like with so many new razors coming out and a lot of them offering up either a prototype or a finished razor for a pass around it may be a good idea. Apparently not in your opinion and like I said I respect your viewpoint on the situation. 

I do appreciate the fact that you offer a 30 day money back return policy. I for one would not take advantage of that. In my talks with one of the most respected razor makers in the USA he shared with me that it is against the law to resell a used razor so that's why he doesn't offer a return policy. I know from talks with another well known razor maker that does offer a return policy that because of the law they have to either give away razors that get returned or use other measures to unload them. I don't know maybe different states have different laws regarding the subject. Just going by what I've been told.  So for me I would never be a part of that. If I bought a razor from let's say you or any other razor maker and unless it was defective from the manufacture I would not return it if was just a case of the razor not working for me. I'll sell it on the BST or online and take the loss rather than lay that loss on the razor maker since it was my decision to buy it in the first place.

I've been very fortunate to have shaved with hundreds of both vintage and modern razors and I'm now a lot more selective in what razors I purchase than I was a few years ago. So I've signed up for like 3 pass arounds and I've also been asked to do both private and open reviews of prototypes of razors that were not yet released and honestly I'm glad I got to try them all out as some I've used are absolutely razors I'm purchasing or have pre paid for while others just didn't do it for me and I'm glad I didn't lay out the money for them only to turn around and have to sell them shortly afterwards.  So to me pass arounds have their pluses and minuses. Just my take on the subject. 

With all that said I wish you all the best with the release of this very special project you took on bringing back an Iconic razor like the Tradere to the wet shaving community and I look forward to reading all the reviews on the SB version as I already have the 1st Gen OC which I’m very happy with it and the SB has my attention. 

Regards

Frank

Hey Frank, 
[font=UICTFontTextStyleBody]
I can appreciate a well-considered argument even if I disagree with it so thanks for sharing your thoughts. I won’t lay out all the issues I have with pass arounds here. But a big issue that I will address is returns.

I’ve also said this before. USE RETURNS WHEN THEY ARE OFFERED. It’s baked into the business model so my products are priced to allow for a certain percentage of returns. I want you to return products you don’t like. It hurts my business more for you to offload things on the BST. A return policy is a mechanism to protect both of us. I’m protected from a stuck, unhappy customer and you’re protected from being stuck. It helps us both and is an important part of my business so please use it. I’ll probably eventually do a sale on used razors. In the meantime, return things you don’t want. If I didn’t want you to return products, I wouldn’t let you.
[/font]

Very good info and points Shane and if you have the returns figured into your business model then that makes me feel better. I alway felt that some folks took advantage of just trying a razor to say ' Oh yeah I used one of those once but I didn't like it and returned it! All the while knowing they were going to return it before they even bought it.. you know the type I'm talking about and it used to bug the Cr*P out of me. So I never wanted to take advantage of a razor maker and create a loss for you as all you guys have my utmost respect.

Thanks for explaining!  

Very good info and points Shane and if you have the returns figured into your business model then that makes me feel better. I alway felt that some folks took advantage of just trying a razor to say ' Oh yeah I used one of those once but I didn't like it and returned it! All the while knowing they were going to return it before they even bought it.. you know the type I'm talking about and it used to bug the Cr*P out of me. So I never wanted to take advantage of a razor maker and create a loss for you as all you guys have my utmost respect.

Thanks for explaining! 

Some folks do take advantage of the return policy, but that's expected and okay. This is a business and I don't expect people to take it personally or look after my best interests. I make rules and know that those rules are going to be bent by some to squeeze as much as they can from the business. That's all part of the game and it doesn't bother me at all.

Question to Shane. Does your 30 day return policy apply to your international customers, as well. If so, they may need much more than 30 days assuming the long delivery times (both directions). Just curious on part of those fellas.

... Hey Frank, 
[font=UICTFontTextStyleBody]
I can appreciate a well-considered argument even if I disagree with it so thanks for sharing your thoughts. I won’t lay out all the issues I have with pass arounds here. But a big issue that I will address is returns.

I’ve also said this before. USE RETURNS WHEN THEY ARE OFFERED. It’s baked into the business model so my products are priced to allow for a certain percentage of returns. I want you to return products you don’t like. It hurts my business more for you to offload things on the BST. A return policy is a mechanism to protect both of us. I’m protected from a stuck, unhappy customer and you’re protected from being stuck. It helps us both and is an important part of my business so please use it. I’ll probably eventually do a sale on used razors. In the meantime, return things you don’t want. If I didn’t want you to return products, I wouldn’t let you.

[/font]

    Your reply rocks Shane!  A well considered, top shelf policy, and a crystal clear, convincing explanation (but don't let that go to your head  ).

What's the hold up on Tradere? Is it gonna be a while before you break your silence on a release date?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I haven’t been silent about a release date; I just don’t have one yet. Machining is wrapping up now. Polishing is up next.

Shane, I'm curious, can you tell us how long it should take to mirror polish a safety razor ?

A Blackbird for example ? 

I had a vendor/artisan say 4 hours each, but the relatively small charge for polished versus machine finish seems to belie that assertion.

... Hey Frank, 
[font=UICTFontTextStyleBody]
I can appreciate a well-considered argument even if I disagree with it so thanks for sharing your thoughts. I won’t lay out all the issues I have with pass arounds here. But a big issue that I will address is returns.

I’ve also said this before. USE RETURNS WHEN THEY ARE OFFERED. It’s baked into the business model so my products are priced to allow for a certain percentage of returns. I want you to return products you don’t like. It hurts my business more for you to offload things on the BST. A return policy is a mechanism to protect both of us. I’m protected from a stuck, unhappy customer and you’re protected from being stuck. It helps us both and is an important part of my business so please use it. I’ll probably eventually do a sale on used razors. In the meantime, return things you don’t want. If I didn’t want you to return products, I wouldn’t let you.

[/font]

    Your reply rocks Shane!  A well considered, top shelf policy, and a crystal clear, convincing explanation (but don't let that go to your head  ).

high-speed I just happen to have my reading glasses on and can see that very small print. HaHa funny. Sorry , but I just had to acknowledge the humor, carry on.

Question to Shane.  Does your 30 day return policy apply to your international customers, as well.  If so, they may need much more than 30 days assuming the long delivery times (both directions).  Just curious on part of those fellas.

The policy applies to all, but international customers are decidedly at a disadvantage. Customers have 30 days from the time they receive the product for it to arrive back here. I'm flexible on that for international customers whose packages just take forever to ship here. As long as they legitimately try to get it back here within 30 days I don't mind if it takes 35 or 40. There's a cut-off somewhere, but nobody has hit it. The main reason international customers can't really do returns is the cost of shipping and VAT/Customs fees. A European customer will pay $20 shipping (non-refundable) when ordering from our site. They'll then pay taxes and/or import fees which are typically in the neighborhood of 18-20%. So for a $185 Blackbird, they're already into it for ~$250. Then if they want to ship it back, they'll pay for that, too. Let's call it $25. That means to return a razor they eat shipping both ways ($45) and the taxes they paid (~$35) for a total of $80 that they won't get back. So if they can get more on the secondary market that's the better way for them to go. Because of this, the number of international returns I've received is probably in the single digits.

To be clear, I hate this. I'm just not big enough to have localized distribution/returns in multiple places around the world. I wish I could.

What's the hold up on Tradere? Is it gonna be a while before you break your silence on a release date?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I haven’t been silent about a release date; I just don’t have one yet. Machining is wrapping up now. Polishing is up next.

Shane, I'm curious, can you tell us how long it should take to mirror polish a safety razor ?

A Blackbird for example ? 

I had a vendor/artisan say 4 hours each, but the relatively small charge for polished versus machine finish seems to belie that assertion.

It depends. A Wolfman-esque finish could certainly take that long. Hand sanding is incredibly laborious and is required for a perfect finish. I've done it for testing and for a few of my own razors and it is not fun. My finishing standards are slightly relaxed in order to produce larger quantities. A polish takes under an hour from start to finish, including cleaning.

On the other side of things, a tumbled polish can take well over four hours, but dozens or hundreds of parts are being polished simultaneously and the result can be acceptable, but not great.

Question to Shane.  Does your 30 day return policy apply to your international customers, as well.  If so, they may need much more than 30 days assuming the long delivery times (both directions).  Just curious on part of those fellas.

The policy applies to all, but international customers are decidedly at a disadvantage. Customers have 30 days from the time they receive the product for it to arrive back here. I'm flexible on that for international customers whose packages just take forever to ship here. As long as they legitimately try to get it back here within 30 days I don't mind if it takes 35 or 40. There's a cut-off somewhere, but nobody has hit it. The main reason international customers can't really do returns is the cost of shipping and VAT/Customs fees. A European customer will pay $20 shipping (non-refundable) when ordering from our site. They'll then pay taxes and/or import fees which are typically in the neighborhood of 18-20%. So for a $185 Blackbird, they're already into it for ~$250. Then if they want to ship it back, they'll pay for that, too. Let's call it $25. That means to return a razor they eat shipping both ways ($45) and the taxes they paid (~$35) for a total of $80 that they won't get back. So if they can get more on the secondary market that's the better way for them to go. Because of this, the number of international returns I've received is probably in the single digits.

To be clear, I hate this. I'm just not big enough to have localized distribution/returns in multiple places around the world. I wish I could.

I haven’t been silent about a release date; I just don’t have one yet. Machining is wrapping up now. Polishing is up next.

Shane, I'm curious, can you tell us how long it should take to mirror polish a safety razor ?

A Blackbird for example ? 

I had a vendor/artisan say 4 hours each, but the relatively small charge for polished versus machine finish seems to belie that assertion.

It depends. A Wolfman-esque finish could certainly take that long. Hand sanding is incredibly laborious and is required for a perfect finish. I've done it for testing and for a few of my own razors and it is not fun. My finishing standards are slightly relaxed in order to produce larger quantities. A polish takes under an hour from start to finish, including cleaning.

On the other side of things, a tumbled polish can take well over four hours, but dozens or hundreds of parts are being polished simultaneously and the result can be acceptable, but not great.

Thank you for the reply Shane !