#21
(08-11-2019, 04:56 PM)CK89 Wrote:
(08-11-2019, 03:45 PM)Kehole Wrote: Have you guys seen the razor market these days? Why is he guilty of anything other than pricing according to market standards?

What's market standard?
316L RR GC for $57? 316L Wolfman around $500? Timeless Ti for $225? 316L RAW RS10 for $365? 316L PAA for $80?

Can you give me a price range? In my opinion, every company has their own price range, and that is OK.

I have all five razors listed above and I am fine with their prices.  
Since I don't know (1) how much they spent for research, (2) how many razors they will manufacture, and (3) how much their exact cost is. 

Everybody has own standards, that is fine for me. 
However, I am not happy that one of them makes quality or manufacture cost lower than his previous models, then cost me more!  
That is not a good sign!


Charcoal goods
Carbon
Wolfman
RAW
Rocnel

Etc etc etc. are all around 250 or more. This is the standard.

Imo, the statement that 316 is vastly superior to 303 or 304 for our razor applications are dubious at best. I don’t use saltwater when shaving personally and I don’t store blades in my razors long term.

In all honesty, the price point of the 17-4 was waaaay too low. Using this as a comp and basis for the argument that this razor is over priced just isn’t realistic. This, coupled with the fact that the 17-4 was the sophomore release from a relatively unknown razor maker at the time makes it a poor choice to argue the merits of this razors price. You have to recall that the only razor preceding the 17-4 was the relatively obscure, although now well known, ti1 razor.

The market has changed, material and labor cost have changed.

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#22

Snuff
Belgium
Everybody has to make up his mind if this razor is worth buying, I have preordered (and so have a few of my friends), I really love the shaves from the Javelin and this one is even more smooth according to Andy.

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“I’m just a spiritual being having a human experience”
#23
(This post was last modified: 08-11-2019, 11:21 PM by Burtonburger.)
(08-11-2019, 03:45 PM)Kehole Wrote: Have you guys seen the razor market these days? Why is he guilty of anything other than pricing according to market standards?

I have and considering the price they ask for the Diamondback and the material used, it should have been polished in my opinion, the Javelin prototype was and i think i prefered the Javelin handle as well, but that is just my personal taste.

CK89 likes this post
#24
(This post was last modified: 08-11-2019, 11:39 PM by CK89.)
(08-11-2019, 06:25 PM)Kehole Wrote: In all honesty, the price point of the 17-4 was waaaay too low. Using this as a comp and basis for the argument that this razor is over priced just isn’t realistic. This, coupled with the fact that the 17-4 was the sophomore release from a relatively unknown razor maker at the time makes it a poor choice to argue the merits of this razors price. You have to recall that the only razor preceding the 17-4 was the relatively obscure, although now well known, ti1 razor.

Wished to Paradigm keep going to manufacture 17-4 with mirror polished. Or similar model. 
If they gave your explanation, I would be OK to purchase similar to 17-4 with higher price. 
Since you are right, there is no more razor for $230 with mirror polishing. 
I will pass this razor, but fully respect who would like to get it.

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#25
Andy probably got burned on the 17-4 release. Kind of a neat marketing but he didn't realize how difficult it was to machine with.
So to play it safe maybe he chose 303 since it is easier to machine. The price is is what it is. Timeless is cheaper though - $200 for 304 polished stainless steel.
For $240 it should have been 316 SS polished. I am out.

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#26

Member
Northern NJ
I find the aesthetics nice in a very simplistic kind of way. I don’t mind the handle shape either. I’ve never used a Paradigm DE and the Titanium SE was a catch and release for me for being too mild. .8 sounds like a nice good gap although that’s not the only important metric. How was the blade feel and efficiency with the other Paradigm DE razors? Are they rigid stable shavers? I always relate Paradigm to reading reviews that they are all smooth shavers. Is this new offering designed to fill a specific void in the lineup? What’s the intended goal of the Diamondback?
#27

Living on the edge
(This post was last modified: 08-12-2019, 10:51 AM by Tester28.)
(08-12-2019, 05:41 AM)Marcos Wrote: I find the aesthetics nice in a very simplistic kind of way. I don’t mind the handle shape either. I’ve never used a Paradigm DE and the Titanium SE was a catch and release for me for being too mild. .8 sounds like a nice good gap although that’s not the only important metric. How was the blade feel and efficiency with the other Paradigm DE razors? Are they rigid stable shavers? I always relate Paradigm to reading reviews that they are all smooth shavers. Is this new offering designed to fill a specific void in the lineup? What’s the intended goal of the Diamondback?

I like the looks too...while I'd be wary of taking a Wolfman on travels or using with abandon, The Diamondback
looks like it's up for anything. The slightly drab finish means I wouldn't fret if it hit a faucet or took a spill.

The javelin prototype video featured a head with decent amount of blade exposure and they say this Diamondback head is about the same.
THat reviewer also said efficiency is same as CG Lvl2 and Timeless 95...that confused me a bit because T95 is noticeably more
aggressive than CG2 for me. I wish the write-up at WCS addressed more important things than using 2 paragraphs to apologise
for not using aluminium.

I see where this guy is coming from with regards to pricing. His past razors have been pretty successful and he's also seen the
prices they have climbed to on the resale market. Previously his cache was limited edition type runs....if he's planning just two
runs for this one, he probably wants to secure a decent price for them before they get scarce and start selling for higher.

The smoothness of this razor has been highlighted quite a bit...if it's smoother than say a WR2 head, I think it would be a good one.

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#28

Snuff
Belgium
(08-12-2019, 06:55 AM)Tester28 Wrote: reviewer also said efficiency is same as CG Lvl2 and Timeless 95...that confused me a bit because T95 is noticeably more
aggressive than CG2 for me. 

Efficiency of the Javelin IMHO better as CG Lvl2 (and for me even Lvl3), I won't comment on the Timeless 95 as it has been gone from my den too long to remember exactly but the Javelin surely feels smoother during the shave. But all of that is irrelevant as the head was changed, we will have to wait for reviews of the final product.

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“I’m just a spiritual being having a human experience”
#29
(This post was last modified: 08-12-2019, 03:21 PM by CK89.)
(08-12-2019, 06:55 AM)Tester28 Wrote: THat reviewer also said efficiency is same as CG Lvl2 and Timeless 95...that confused me a bit because T95 is noticeably more
aggressive than CG2 for me. I wish the write-up at WCS addressed more important things than using 2 paragraphs to apologise
for not using aluminium.

CG LVL2 and Timeless TI .95 have very similar efficiency for me. But stainless steel version I don't know honestly.
#30
(This post was last modified: 08-12-2019, 05:59 PM by ANG69.)
I have/had two Paradigm razors. Ti 1 generation and an SE. The Ti 1 gen has a permanent place in my 15+ safety razor collection, though it is a tad too aggressive to be used as a daily shaver. But it is simply perfect for me with 36 hrs and above growth. The SE turned out to be too mild.

While I agree that the description of the Paradigm Diamondback should have provided greater detail about its shaving characteristics, I do not find the price to be excessively high. Would I like it to be lower? Of course... Would I want the razor to be polished? Not really. I find polished razors too difficult to maintain and it is not what I would like to focus on. Is the SS 303 a deal breaker? Absolutely not. My most favorite razor (Blackbird) is made from this grade and I never had any problems with it. Do I like the design? Heck yeah! It is simple and elegant.

All in all, I decided to pull the trigger and pre-ordered the Paradigm Diamondback. Especially after I received the green light from the SWMBO! Smile And I must admit I am as excited about this razor as I am thrilled about Shane reintroducing the Tradere.

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