Carbon Shaving Co. Cx-316L & Ti DFS pass around

Package has been mailed to Lesser. Thanks again for the opportunity to participate!

Here's a quick few tips/rules for the pass around.  Please try to be mindful of the creator of the razor and everyone on the pass around list.  If you're going to be out of town just before or during your turn, just ask us to bump you down on the list so you can have the proper time to use it and so you also do not hold up others from trying the razor(s) in a timely manner.

As this pass around includes more than 1 razor, let's agree to keep it for 10-14 days before passing it on so people have adequate time to use and judge everything.

Also, please insure the razor for $1,000 just in case it gets lost in the mail..

List:
andrewjs18 (Pennsylvania)
ewk (South Carolina)
Eleven (South Carolina)
MountainBear ()
Cino (Georgia)
Marhos24 (Michigan)
draebeard (Washington) *removed at user's request*
Calm_Shaver (New York)
BEARDoc (Rhode Island)
Dragonsbeard (New York)
rocket (Colorado)
NJDJ (California)
Lesser  (New York)
dtownvino (Pennsylvania) *removed at user's request*
ppshil (Pennsylvania)
Time Bandit (California)
atxwatch (Texas)
Stickshift (Illinois)
Mpescado (New Jersey)
andrewjs18 (Pennsylvania)

Received. Will start trying!

May I join this pass around please? andrewjs18

Edit: i am in texas

I apologize for my slow start in trying the Carbon.  I've been traveling a bit. But I have had two shaves now.  

The first was with the 316 and the original plate.
The second was with the Carbon Ti and I used the + plate.

The one thing I've noticed with razors and plates is that they grip the blades not as far out as my usual razors.  There's a noticeable difference between these and my mainstay H&S N075.  That leads to increased chatter.  More than I'm really used to.  

But having said that, some other observations:

First, these are lovely looking razors.   The web plates are just plain handsome.  And the handles have a very distinctive character to them both.  Very very nice.

Second, I was surprised to like the Ti more than the 316.  Surprised because I usually like heavier razors more.  Here, the lightness clicked.  In fact, the first shave was a bit difficult for me.  Got a few tiny cuts, which is rare for me.  Between the scraping chatter quality and a few small nicks, I was wondering.  However, the second shave with the Atlas really was excellent.  It felt exceedingly smooth and easy.  Just a breeze.  I did get two tiny nicks but I'm going to try another time or two and I suspect I could really dial into this razor.  I also will have to try out the ++ plate and also go to the other extreme with the -.  So, that's my initial report.  Just initial.

So, my tools were:
Brush:  APShave with G5C
Soap:  A&E Vacanza Romana and T+S Indian Bay.
Splashes:  Ethos Clean and Summer Break History 101
Blade:  GSB

I’ve done another three shaves.  Very much the same as my prior posting except to add that I’ve come to see how this razor can give an incredibly good shaves.  The design is really spot-on. While I found the – (minus) plate a too soft and the original a touch soft, both the + and ++ plates give me BBS shaves.  The ++ was slightly more than I wanted, and I felt as though I had to be careful.  However, the + plate with the titanium cap and the R2 handle made for two great shaves.  No work at all.  So very easy and, without effort, went to what I would call DFS+.  As with my original post, my only complaint would be that, for me, I get more feedback and chatter than I like. I attribute that either to the amount of blade outside the clamp point or the webbed base plates (which are dynamite looking, by the way).

And, strangely when I unpacked the box, I noticed and didn’t take out the puck of soap from Eleven.  I did remember it yesterday, fortunately, and used it today.  While I’m not a large fan of barbershop scents, this was one fine soap.  Went on easily and smoothly, gave me a great shave.  Glad to have made the acquaintance of Eleven soaps!

In sum, this is a fantastic piece of shaving kit.  And I have to say a huge thank you to @"andrewsj18" for taking the time to organize and oversee this pass around and, of course, to Sean at CarbonShavingCo.. And Paolo at Eleven.  This the kind of passaround that makes being a member of DFS so enjoyable!  I've been in contact with ppshil and will be getting it out to him in the next few days.

Received razors from Lesser today. Thanks!
I could not contain my excitement and went for a quick head shave with the minus plate with the carbon razor. Detail impressions to follow, but a quick summary: smooth. One wtg and one atg to bbs. So no lack of efficiency in my book, at least on the dome. I will repeat head shaves with this plate, and try to compare to my other favorites for the dome: charcoal goods everyday and blutt 0.86. Thanks again to Sean, Andrew and DFS for this generous opportunity!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Carbon SS Original vs. Ti Plus (+) Comparison Shave

Background/Bias:
I own the Carbon in Titanium with the Plus Plus (++) plate, have used it quite a bit, and like to use it on more than a day's growth. I generally prefer lighter razors; I like to be able to control the pressure myself rather than letting the weight of the razor play into it. While very happy with my ++ Ti plate, I wanted to explore the other plates for two reasons - 

1. I don't enjoy the ++ plate as much on my head. I find that the large gap with minimal blade feel sometimes leads me to open up blemishes easily. I am sure I can get better with practice, but why??? I have too much money laying around. 

2. on my against the grain passes, I find I'm wishing the ++ plate was smoother. Don't get me wrong, it is smooth. But as as smooth/comfortable as say, the Blutt 0.86 or Overlander or the CG Everyday plate. So my reasoning is, with the smaller gaps on the other plates, maybe the ATG would be more comfortable? Hopefully, the sacrifice in efficiency would not bee too great.

Setup:
Left side of my face: Carbon SS Original plate
Right side of my face: Ti Plus (+) plate
Preshave: Warm water, warm towel, PAA Pre-shave Cube
Soap: Tabac
Brush: Simpson T3 Synthetic
Blades: Gillette 7 'O Clock Super Platinum (Black) - both 2nd use, I have found these to be sharper than Gillette Platinum and lasts as long
Post: WSP Black Ember

Pass 1, with the grain, N->S on my face, Chin -> Shoulder on my neck
First surpriset I have to mention, the lightness of the Carbon is very very pleasant. It is the lightest razor (bar plastic) I have ever used. It is surprisingly pleasant in the hand. Felt like a feather, yet substantial on the face. It's hard to describe. I did not think I would like this handle so much. The second surprise was, I did not perceive a significant difference in blade feel between the two plates. I have always read that the original plate has a LOT of blade feel. However, I did not feel that way. Even with the significant weight difference, both plates felt equally comfortable on my face. And they both mowed down two days growth effortlessly. I tried to keep going over same areas multiple times without soap to a minimum. Feeling around before rinsing, I did not feel much difference in the amount of subtle left behind. So at this point, very similar feel, very very similar results. If I were a one pass shave guy, either would work just as well.

Pass 2, across the grain, W->E and E->W (Left, right) on my face, S ->N / N->S on my chin
Again, very comfortable on both sides. On my chin, strangely, I found I was going over areas more with the Plus plate compared to the Original plate. Theoretically, I would expect the opposite, as the Plus plate, with a higher gap, is supposed to be more efficient. But I did experience this. I wonder if I was somehow messing up with angle on the Plus plate, or not compensating for the weight difference with enough pressure. But, the way I shave (with whatever flaws in technique), there was not a significant difference in blade feel but the original plate appeared to be taking off more stubble. I confirmed this with taking some lather in my hand and feeling around on my face.

Pass 3, against the grain, S->N on my face, SW->NE on left side of neck, SE->NW on right side of neck
I was hoping that the plus plate, with the smaller gap (than the ++), and smaller blade exposure, would be the winner here in terms of comfort and efficiency. That is what I had thought what my preference is based on my shaving experiences and what I thought I understood about razor design. Wrong. The original plate again felt a smoother, albeit both smoother than the ++ plate. However, once finished, I felt more stubble left over on the Plus side than the Original side! Confused and shaking my head at this point! I buy a few razors and I think I know everything when in reality there may be many more things razor designers are making decisions on that I don't know and understand. 

Touch-up
I lathered the areas requiring touchup. I went over the areas slowly, using my other hand to move lather when buffing. I did the best I could on each side. Then felt around. Again, I felt like the right side (+ plate), still had more stubble left compared to the left (original). A bit frustrated at this point, I re-lathered. Now, switching sides. I used the original plate on the right side, and easily picked up what was left over. Now here is the weird part, on the left side, I expected the plus would not pick up anything. But I felt the plus still cutting a but on the left side too!

Alum
Minimal sting on both sides. Perhaps a tad more on the right side of my face/neck.

Conclusion
I need to repeat this comparison, switching the sides of my face, and switching the handles. I suspect my angle is not optimal for the plus plate. Did any of you experience anything similar? 

Conclusion 2
If it weren't for my OCD, either plate would be fine for daily use for me (on the face, the head is another story for another time). But I MUST know which is better. So ...

Thanks all for posting these great reviews and comments.

I am not in the pass around but own a Carbon Graphite Ti with all of the baseplates and my favorite baseplate is the original - it has the right amount of blade feel for me and the right amount of efficiency, and gives smooth shaves every time.

Some have pointed out that the baseplate and top cap don’t clamp the blade as close to the blade edge as do some other modern razors, resulting in a larger “span” between the edge of the top cap and the edge of the blade.  This is definitely true, but it doesn’t hurt the shave for me, and in fact I prefer my Carbon Cx to some of my other razors that clamp the blade closer to the blade edge.  I’m not sure why this is the case, but suspect it has to do with the overall design of the razor - blade gap, blade exposure, blade bend, etc.   It is probably an illusion, but it feels to me almost like there is some flexibility in the razor blade when I shave which makes the shave more forgiving without creating any chatter.  Not sure what’s going on with that, and, as I say, it is probably illusory.

I also greatly appreciate how thin and compact the razor head is and how maneuverable it is as a result.

Sean - thanks for producing this razor and all of its variants, and for participating in the pass around and this thread.  Hopefully you will chime in with your thoughts about the design of this great razor.

Thanks ppshil  for the support and for trying out the other plates...I thought I would add this photo from my website to show the gaps and exposures of the different plates...enjoy the journey!

Keep me posted if you want me to send some more sample blades. My most popular blades recommended by customers are still the Kai, Nacet, Blue and the Astras. I tend to test with an Astra for consistency…

Musical  with regards to your comment:

“Some have pointed out that the baseplate and top cap don’t clamp the blade as close to the blade edge as do some other modern razors, resulting in a larger “span” between the edge of the top cap and the edge of the blade.  This is definitely true, but it doesn’t hurt the shave for me, and in fact I prefer my Carbon Cx to some of my other razors that clamp the blade closer to the blade edge.  I’m not sure why this is the case, but suspect it has to do with the overall design of the razor - blade gap, blade exposure, blade bend, etc.  It is probably an illusion, but it feels to me almost like there is some flexibility in the razor blade when I shave which makes the shave more forgiving without creating any chatter.  Not sure what’s going on with that, and, as I say, it is probably illusory.”

Lesser  I think this touches on your comment also:

“As with my original post, my only complaint would be that, for me, I get more feedback and chatter than I like. I attribute that either to the amount of blade outside the clamp point or the webbed base plates (which are dynamite looking, by the way).”

My thoughts and design considerations include:

The "Blade span" as I have heard this measurement called or as is referred to above as "blade outside the clamp point" was a consideration in the Cx design.

Our "span" is closer to the 1945 tech, however this Tech did not have a clamp design. We added a pinch to this design configuration and modified it from there.

In terms of clamped blade designs, I can't say we looked at many manufacturers however we did look at the Feather AS-D2...very well designed razor, although I believe it is MIM made and not machined. We have a similar "span" to the Feather AS-D2 design. We did add more horsepower(Our mild plate is similar but with more efficiency and blade feel)

Similar to the ASD2 and from what I have seen from photos, the Wolfman designs, with their pinch, has a similar "span" to ours.

During testing we did have a version which pinched closer but it was bulkier and we also experienced a limited shave angle range i.e. we were unable to "ride the cap" as effectively, it locked you tighter into a specific angle. Having some user control was important in our design considerations.

After seeing a few new manufacturers claim the benefits of a closer pinch design, we were curious again if a closer pinch would be a better design and deliver a better shave. We tested this by adding a shim to the top our Cx head, the shim was narrower then the cutting blade edge and did reduce/stiffen the span. We used epoxy to replicate the pinch on the underside and to reinforce the shim. We didn't experience any change in the shave.

One benefit I contribute to the larger span (although I can't quantify this) is the audible feedback...we hear that a lot about our Cx model. Is this negative blade chatter? We don't think so, however it is definitely feedback, which we think is a positive...the forces at play with skin, steel and pressures are relative small

Lesser we had the same audio feedback with our non web version. I don’t think the web design adds to the audible feedback you experienced.

When the hair is shaved I don’t hear the feedback from my experience...

I gotta give credit to the Feather ASD2 for the first formal pinch design (I think they were first?)...just by supporting the underside of a blade and clamping the blade stiff, it changes the characteristics of the shave. Considering the forces at play with shaving, I am not sold further that a closer clamping is a benefit...the big variables are still gap, blade exposure, any pinch design and blade angle in razor designs, from our perspective.

Totally open to other thoughts...